Sen. Rand Paul, R-Ky., locked horns with podcast host Katie Couric after she minimized concerns about mass illegal immigration by claiming that less than 14% have been charged or convicted of violent crimes.
Couric spoke to Paul on Wednesday about the ongoing immigration debate in Minneapolis. Paul argued that local officials’ refusal to cooperate with federal agents’ efforts to deport illegal immigrants has been a source of chaos, even though he does not agree with federal agents’ improper use of force.
“This whole argument about the role of Minneapolis police in this or Minneapolis state officials might be more applicable, Senator, if ICE agents were truly talking about the ‘worst of the worst,’ as the president likes to say,” Couric replied. “Less than 14% of nearly 400,000 immigrants arrested by ICE and President Trump’s first year back in the White House had charges or convictions for violent criminal offenses, supporting to an internal Department of Homeland Security document obtained by CBS News.”
She then proceeded to ask, “So isn’t all this talk about ridding the country of violent criminals a massive overstatement? If less than 14%, again, of the 400,000 immigrants being arrested are had charges or convictions for violent criminal offenses?”
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“I think the facts make a difference, and so that’s one of the questions we will ask, and so, when you come to Minneapolis, if they have a policy that says, oh, we’re not going to turn over from our jails nonviolent prisoners, people who are, I don’t know why you’re in prison if you’re nonviolent, but maybe you have a drug crime that’s a nonviolent,” Paul said.
“I think there are plenty of non-violent people in prison,” Couric replied.
“But the thing is, that’s not their policy,” Paul said. “Their policy is ‘we will turn no one over.’ So you can be, you beat somebody half to death, you get an assault charge, and you’re in jail for a couple years, and somehow you’re getting out on parole, and you’re not going to be turned over, and you are illegal, I’ve got a problem with that and so do probably most independents and Democrats. But that’s what we have to ascertain.”
Paul went on to argue that most people are probably in the middle on this issue, to the point that while they are against excessive force against protesters, “If you ask them, ’If a guy has committed rape, and he’s in prison, and he is going to get out, do you want him deported?’ I think people would say, ‘Hell yes, he ought to be deported.’”
“Having said that though, what about the 14%? Such a low percentage of 400,000 people,” Couric retorted.
“If your daughter gets raped by the guy that gets back out, and he’s one of the 14%, I don’t think you’re going to quibble about whether it’s 14 or 64,” Paul replied. “What I’m saying though, is that if you’re not going to turn over anybody, then that’s 0%.”
“I don’t think the percentage – it makes a halfway argument to how much effort should we have, but if Minnesota’s not going to turn over anybody, the whole argument — whether it’s 14 or 86 — doesn’t mean anything,” the senator continued.
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Other commentators, such as Joe Rogan, have offered a similarly nuanced argument that even a small percentage of a huge amount of illegal immigrants being violent criminals ultimately still implies numerous criminals.
Citing an A.I. analysis showing that 5% to 8% of illegal immigrants caught by ICE had violent or serious property crime convictions, Rogan warned, “I would say 8% is a lot. Like if you have cancer in 8% of your body, I would say you’re f—ed. You know what I’m saying? Like if they’re saying, ‘Oh, it’s only been 8% that are violent criminals,’ it’s a lot. That’s a lot of people.”
